I’ve been wanting to put these experiences to words for a long time because they have been such a rich and interesting part of the week with M, S and friends for about three years now. I seem to keep walking down memory lane in other posts with picture books we have read in our younger days instead:). It has taken me some time to figure out how to describe our process and to even think of a name for this post. I keep hitting up against different pieces. From talking to others, it seems that not many people do things in quite this way – not exactly a book club, not a formal credit, not a curriculum but at the same time, not without some collaboration and focus. The teen years are a time that seems to carry a lot of focus on independence. There is certainly a great deal of independence materializing naturally, but I think a lot can also be gained from exploring ideas together and a parent bringing their own perspective to the table.
There are many great ideas and examples out there for living and learning and unschooling with younger kids. What does exploring and studying ideas in a collaborative way look like for “big kids?”
“Great literature” is quite subjective. We have often started a book, either as a read aloud together or one of the kids on their own, that is considered a classic, but for whatever reason, it doesn’t gel with one or any of us. Genre also comes into play when choosing a book. S is the only one of these guys who really has an interest in fantasy novels so when we choose a common book, that isn’t usually the “go-to” choice. What makes a book “great” is relative to taste, but it’s hard to deny that certain books have stood the test of time!
As for encouraging certain books for a particular age group, of course teens aren’t the only ones who might enjoy these books. S loved a couple of these before the teen years and although they are on high school book lists, my guess is that, for the most part, they were written with adults in mind. I imagine the authors were pulled to creating and developing dimensional stories and big ideas. I doubt their main purpose was for them to only be read (and often dreaded) as part of high school courses and assignments. I think they were meant to be read, pondered, related to and enjoyed.
I would encourage giving these books (or different ones your family might be drawn to) a try in an open-ended way, regardless of the type of home education your family practices or even if your kids are in school and they seem like a fit. Maybe you would like to read them yourself!
Then there is the “exploring” piece. What I mean by this is that once a week, we meet the kids’ friends at one of a few community centres that have libraries. These community centres have skateparks and basketball courts that the guys use and features like big swings and zip lines that the girls tend to gravitate toward. They are days that include a mixture of time outdoors and indoors. At some point when we’re indoors, the guys and I scout out a private study room to read and discuss a book that’s been collaboratively chosen. It’s a bit different from a book club where each person reads on their own time and then comes back to discuss; we read it aloud together, each taking turns and stop and laugh and discuss as we go on.
Interesting ideas come up about theme, setting, plot, character development, foreshadowing, lack of clear antagonist, multiple protagonists, symbolism, cultural, religious or political bias, imagery, allegory, point of view/perspective and so much more. A lot of natural comparisons and contrasts come up between the different books. Sound pretty academic and well, dry? Academic, maybe – depends what we mean by academic; exploring literature isn’t necessarily boring if it’s not being “assigned” and isn’t out of context. Dry? No, the books we’ve read have a fair bit of action, interesting plot and great characterization.
The most fun we have is around character! There is almost always a character that one or more of the guys is particularly annoyed by or finds humorous. In that case, when the character’s part comes up, eyes turn quickly to that person and it’s just kind of known that they will want to read that part. Sometimes we give the characters voices and accents, sometimes we don’t. Sometimes we use a bit of artistic license and add extra comments or nicknames. M is a master at this and he maintains it faithfully for those characters throughout the story;).
What we do might be kind of like the popular movements of Poetry Teatime or Coffee and Books. I think ours would have to be called Literature and Vending Machine Snacks;).
And exploring literature from a life learning, unschooling perspective? Sometimes we naturally seem to move clockwise as far as whose turn it is to read, sometimes it’s just whoever volunteers or feels like reading the longest. At times there seems to be a natural spot for the person reading to stop and pass on to someone else but they look up and say they’d like to read longer if we don’t mind. Nobody ever minds:). Nothing is “assigned.” I’m not quizzing anyone on the facts. I’m not asking for a narration of the events but guess what? When you’re naturally exploring a story, you often want to comment and make observations. Lots of them.
They aren’t writing essays about the books – unless they are, lol. For example, at this point, these guys are older teens, and having read and studied different books gives a great range of material if needed for essays to demonstrate the “evidence of learning” asked for if registering for a course that might be a prerequisite. That’s exactly what M did to gain registration into an online Grade 12 Provincial English credit he needed to apply to the post-secondary path he’s looking into. It worked beautifully.
Sometimes a book that we thought would be good just isn’t a fit. Or maybe the timing isn’t right for it, so we choose a different one. Anyone is free to put their perspective out there or opt out. L has only been part of two and a half of the books for this reason. It just isn’t her preferred way of reading. There aren’t right or wrong opinions about the story; everyone notices something different.
Whatever it is that we are doing, I thought I’d put the ideas out in case people who are looking for connected reading and literature ideas past the younger and middle years can take something from them.
Some of the books that have worked well across the board …
Who Has Seen The Wind by W.O. Mitchell
This is just simply my favourite novel. My mum’s light green copy from her university English class was in our bookcase throughout my childhood but I never really looked at it beyond that. One night when S was about 11 and unable to sleep in the wee hours, he noticed it and we began reading it together. We read it in little bits and pieces over the next two years anytime we were there but never made it to the absolute end (so close though!) until this time around when we began reading it with his friends.
It’s a story that is both simple and profound in its view of life, birth and death, faith, spirituality, family and community as well as just “the feel” of the Canadian Prairie during the Depression. It is experienced from the perspective (written in third person) of several residents of a small Saskatchewan Prairie town, but primarily from that of the protagonist, Brian, a young boy throughout early to later childhood.
The imagery is incredible. The language is beautiful. The characters are just so rich. There are some other Canadian books with wonderful characters but honestly, if you read closely, even my beloved Mrs. Rachel Lynde and Anne Shirley haven’t got anything on Mrs. Abercrombie and young Brian O’Connal. Then there is the fascinating Young Ben …
Some key points of conversation I remember us having – food for thought:
The socioeconomic structure of the town – sooo interesting and relatable to some other recent books we have read (To Kill a Mockingbird) and an interesting reflection on our own community in places as well.
Prejudice – both racial and class-based
Hyprocisy (moral and religious)
How related (or not) certain aspects of the story are to the fact that it takes place in the Depression Era eg. Was the community closer knit because it was such a difficult economic time? Did some of the tragedies occur because it was Depression era and people were tired and stressed?
Characters. There are some dynamic characters who really grow and show themselves to be multi-dimensional and there are others who remain very static and stereotypical. There are some powerful, emotional moments and there are some downright hilarious ones, especially if you pay attention to some of the understated descriptions and dialogue;).
Symbolism. This was fascinating because the Prairie wind is a consistent piece that threads throughout the story and shows itself whenever Brian is experiencing “the feeling” or God. It is thought that the wind symbolizes God. And the wind comes in many different forms throughout the story – so much there to reflect on. A couple of the guys were particularly fascinated by that link.
I don’t think this would be everyone’s favourite book. I’ve distinctly heard from some people that it’s not. There is actually quite a bit of action but it is threaded through the story in a slow-moving way, if that makes any sense. It has been used for university level study and although it certainly could be interesting reading for a teen, if you have the opportunity to read and enjoy it together, there is so much room for conversation and perspective.
*There are a couple of heavy happenings in the book, most notably a suicide (sad but not particularly graphic) and the torturing of a Prairie animal (somewhat graphic). Those two incidents, although significant to the meaning to the story, can be censored somewhat or warned about ahead of time as far as actual details.
To Kill A Mockingbird – Harper Lee
This book was incredibly interesting and impactful for all of us. It was a favourite!
We watched the movie afterward and while we enjoyed it, I think we were all disappointed. I had only ever seen bits and pieces of it. There were so many elements missing that we’d enjoyed in the book and the guys really noticed it. The movie would move on to something new and they’d look up, shocked – “But what about …?” Or “Hey, they didn’t show…!”
Pieces that came up in conversation while reading the book included:
- The changing dynamic in relationships between siblings as they get older
- Race relations
- Gender roles
- Single parenting
- Role of extended family
- Critical thinking about education and schooling (there are some really interesting tidbits about the learning process)
- Capital punishment
- Discrimination based on colour or family name
- The concept of “innocent until proven guilty”
- The culture of small towns
Pieces that came up most strongly were comparisons to Who Has Seen the Wind, something that never crossed my mind until we were partway through. I suddenly noticed it, mentioned it, and then the guys just started flooding the conversation with comparisons.
For example, both stories are set in Great Depression – era small towns. Both focus on the social status of various families in the community – prominent, less-respected and downright outcasted. Both explore racism and prejudice and show the possible resulting tragedy. Both follow main characters from early childhood through the elementary school years. Both have families who are loving and stable but whose imperfections and vulnerabilities are consistently explored, especially in relation to neither book’s main character being keen on having an older female relative living with them. Both explore the theme of God and faith, although it is much more central in Who Has Seen the Wind. Both have main characters who rub up against the school system in difficult ways as they innocently strive to stay true to themselves. Both have awkward, eccentric best friends. Both notice injustices, large and small, in their world. Finally, both have an insatiable curiosity and determination around figuring out life.
And of course there are differences. Just to name a few, To Kill a Mockingbird is American, written from a first- person perspective and centred around a very specific incident while Who Has Seen the Wind is Canadian, written in the third person perspective and has several stories within the town woven into the main character’s childhood journey. I’m glad we accidentally read one after the other because they really ended up complimenting each other.
And Then There Were None by Agatha Christie
Oh wow. I loved this in a weird sort of way. I don’t distinctly dislike murder mysteries but I’ve never been drawn to them. I had only ever looked over a few pages of anything written by Agatha Christie. It was M who was reading this and I ended up noticing what a page-turner it was. Again, there were so many fascinating pieces …
Some interesting points of discussion were:
What a unique and fascinating mind Agatha Christie must have had!
The practicalities of writing a murder mystery and how it must feel a lot like fitting a puzzle together. For example, even if you have all your good ideas, how do you sort everything out so that people are in the right places for it to all make sense in the end?
“Red herrings” and foreshadowing
The complexity of the human mind
Thoughts about justice and how it plays out
Is vigilantism ever justified?
How the same situation looks from the perspective of different people
Strange cruelty or bad luck in many older nursery rhymes and possible reasons why (the guys really went down a rabbit trail on this one)
Graphic accounts of violence and whether the specific description makes the crime seem more serious to the reader
Animalistic and predator/prey behaviour in humans when under threat
Self-defense and preservation
Murder on the Orient Express by Agatha Christie
So, because of how interesting And Then There Were None was, I looked into some other Agatha Christie novels. We looked at the option of The Mousetrap play versus Murder on the Orient Express and decided on the second. We are still a few chapters away from finishing this one and are enjoying it, although it’s a lot milder than And Then There Were None which I think is a bit disappointing for the guys!
That being said, we’re having to be patient with the plot and pay attention to detail as the stories of the suspects unfold . There is also an interesting focus on the questioning process of the detective.
Some things that have come up in conversation:
Thoughts about the mystery genre in general – is a novel with more murders and almost constant action more interesting or is it fun to have to be more patient as suspense builds around a single murder?
How much more important it seems to be to pay attention to tiny pieces of detail in mysteries
The incredible multi-lingualism of the French detective and how handy that was travelling on a train with so many Europeans from different countries
Potential biases on the part of authors and to what extent they are aware of their bias. We noticed lots of bias and wondered whether Christie would have been aware of it or whether it was just the reality of the time period she was living and writing in?
Whether Christie portrays Americans and Italians in a condescending way – the general consensus was “yes”
Whether we clicked in to the condescending tone because of direct statements from the narrator and other characters or from the American and Italian characters themselves if the character is unlikable. Hmmm … let me try again. We might hear unflattering descriptions of an American from the narrator or in the dialogue of characters. On the other hand, if a character who is unlikable happens to be American, we just begin to think of that particular character in a negative way. By setting the American characters up as negatively stereotyped, Christie might plant certain biases in the reader’s mind.
Haha – that’s as clear as mud, I think, but is an example of the critical thinking that is often running through their conversations.
The ever present focus on cultural stereotypes among the characters from different European countries. After a while we started to get a kick out of this. To the guys, that degree of focus on differences seems strangely old-fashioned and is really noticeable. We all just keep looking up and chuckling.
The Old Man and the Sea by Ernest Hemingway
This was one of the four books that I remember reading in high school English. I know I had to have read more than that because we had the option of 5 years of English classes in Ontario at that time and read more than one book or play per credit but I can only think of those few. I didn’t remember anything about the book except that I found it long and monotonous.
This second time around, I still found it a bit that way but the guys kind of liked it, especially M. When I read it from their point of view, I was able to see quite a bit more to it.
Things that came up in conversation:
When a book is slow-moving, do we tend to pay more attention to the characters?
Is the book actually slow-moving?
When there are only a couple of key characters, do we pay more attention to getting to know the characters?
The role of the sharks in the story and whether they are the antagonists
Is the sea an antagonist in the story?
Just the power of the ocean …
What about the setting? Do we pay more attention because there doesn’t seem to be as much happening.
The feeling of uselessness for an older man who has not been successful recently living in that time period. Is this feeling of uselessness and aging actually a type of antagonist as well?
The role that the description of his hands plays in reflecting his age in the story
His preoccupation with Joe Di Maggio and how that impacts the story
The friendship between an old man and a young man
Perseverance and determination
The Pearl by John Steinbeck
We read this one this past fall and it turned out to be a very interesting book! I’d heard of it but never read it. I had read Steinbeck’s Of Mice and Men and seen the movie waaay on back. We started reading it last spring and I was excited about it but there was a unanimous disinterest by the end of the second chapter and so we decided to leave it.
The Pearl , however, worked really well and we all felt that it actually reminded us of The Old Man and the Sea more than anything. Why? The power of the ocean, the vulnerability of the characters, the idea of a part of nature actually playing the role of protagonist. It was interesting to go online and realize that others had similar perspectives.
Other things that were noticed:
S, in particular, noticed the inclusion of both Christian belief and prayer as well as tribal, superstitious beliefs and ritual – a sort of making sure that they covered their spiritual bases in times of deep trouble.
We noticed lots about power imbalance between Spanish colonial people and Indigenous people
The desperate plight of Kino, the main character, to access education for his son so that he could read and understand the language of the oppressors. This has been a recurring theme in so many books we’ve read over the years, regardless of the particular group of people.
Religious hypocrisy
The double forces gripping Kino and how strongly he experiences them
A lot of imagery (wonderful) and not a lot of dialogue proportionately.
The role of the pearl itself in the story and the way people changed after its discovery
Lord of the Flies by William Golding
Oh wow, again. This was another one of those four novels (and one play!) I remember reading in high school English and it is another one that I remember disliking. Not hating, but definitely not itching to read again. I realize now that I just didn’t get the fullness of it and I think as a high school student, I wasn’t far enough removed from the plot to really appreciate it objectively. Now as an adult, I find the idea of trying to objectively read a book about extreme bullying and a group of youths left to their own devices without enough resources and help from elders, to be an ironic assignment within a public high school. Anyway …
I showed it to the guys (and my daughter this time) and all were interested. And all remained interested. I’d say this book maintained all of our focus more than any other (maybe – Mockingbird was pretty close).
There was just so much to notice and talk about …
Targeting and possible reasons for it. Do people get targeted because of their physical appearance? Their level of intelligence? Their competence? Their personality?
Aligning oneself with a leader and the benefits and risks to that. They had some thoughts about relating certain parts to the saying “better their friend than their enemy.”
Alpha personalities and natural leadership
Role of rules and safeguards in society
Role of adults in society and what happens without a balance of generations and wisdom
Human nature
Survival skills
Organizing for survival
Piggy’s insight from the beginning
Animalistic behaviour / people getting into “Fight or Flight,” predator/ prey roles
Compassion. This was interesting because although they certainly had lots of compassion for Piggy ( the most targeted character), they were also much more irritated by him than I was. As an adult and a parent, I really felt differently about his character than they did. Again, I think it’s so interesting how we might see a story differently, depending on our age and situation, and I got to a point where I could kind of understand their annoyance.
Loyalty and morality in the face of incredibly hard times
Animal Farm by George Orwell
I smile as I write this because this is another book that really held everyone’s attention to the end and interestingly, it was read again as part of a course two of the guys were taking. I also smile because I have a friend who is really not keen on this book and almost looks like she’s in pain if it’s mentioned, but I love it.
It’s an allegory as well as a political satire, reflecting on events leading to the Russian Revolution and continuing into Stalin’s rule of the Soviet Union, written with animals as the main characters.
We enjoy animals and I think S and I, in particular, got a kick out of the animal characters, not because they’re necessarily meant to be humorous, but there are just points where the whole seriousness of the story played out through farm animals just struck us as funny.
What came up in conversation?
- Personification of animals
- the Russian Revolution
- Communism
- Allegory
- Metaphor
- Power
- Subservience
- Alliances
- Pros and cons of different political systems
- Loyalty
- Misrepresentation of truth and intention
- Greed
- Which person in history each animal was an intentional reflection of
This book was a great look at human patterns of behaviour even beyond the Russian Revolution or Stalin. There are certain dynamics of human behaviour in many types of groups that we all recognized in the story!
A Christmas Carol by Charles Dickens
Ah, a Christmas Carol. Originally we looked at Great Expectations but, well, it’s something like 544 pages long and it was November at the time so A Christmas Carol made sense. It was a nice, light read. We have illustrated, abridged versions of chapter book versions of some of Dickens’ books and Great Expectations was a story they had enjoyed, but 544 pages worth for the real thing – none of us felt up to it. A Christmas Carol fit the bill for mid- November. Meaningful and deep but still light from the perspective of length and familiarity.
What thoughts came up?
Selfishness
Generosity
Loneliness
Pain and sadness in early life
Loyalty and patience of Fred for his Uncle Ebenezer Scrooge
Vulnerability
Deep personal change – how likely is it? How often do we think it happens to the degree it did with Scrooge?
Perseverance and gratitude in the presence of hard times in the case of the Cratchitt Family
Forgiveness:)
We had fun with this one and watched three movie versions afterward. I would highly recommend the 1951 version with Alistair Sim, the 1999 version with Patrick Stewart and last but definitely not least, A Muppet Christmas Carol with, well, The Muppets! Again, it was Christmas season of last year so the timing was good!
The Pilgrim’s Progress by John Bunyan
Yes, yes, we did. We ventured into this one as well. I say it this way because of the length and era in which is what written (1600s). I wasn’t at all sure, lol, but they were game to give it a try.
I think having read Animal Farm first ended up working well because they had been introduced to an allegory. A Pilgrim’s Progress was interesting because we paired it with online chapter summaries and actually read about as much of those as the actual book, going back and forth between the two. Another reason I think it was interesting is that the kids were each in a different place in their faith and life view and related to it differently. Finally, they came up with distinct voices for each of the characters which ALWAYS makes it entertaining around here.
I don’t have as much to say about this one because they weren’t as interested in discussing it but they thoroughly enjoyed the voices, understood the main point and were interested enough.
We’ve looked at several other original versions over the years in partnership with abridged versions or graphic novels.
Canterbury Tales – original by Geoffrey Chaucer
Beowulf
Frankenstein – Mary Shelley
Hound of Baskervilles – Conan Doyle
And lots more … L enjoys graphic novels so we often have several around.
Then there are plays. Some we’ve enjoyed include:
Twelve Angry Men – Reginald Rose
The Miracle Worker – William Gibson
Hamlet – William Shakespeare
MacBeth – William Shakespeare
A Midsummer’s Night Dream – William Shakespeare
The Taming of the Shrew – William Shakespeare
I knew these particular plays were coming to our local community theatres so over the years, we have often looked at the plays, either before or after. If there are musicals coming, we often watch the movie version (Les Miserables, Fiddler on the Roof, Sound of Music, etc)
We don’t have a master list of any kind that we’re following. I’ve been looking at reading lists for years and bring forward ideas to them that I think would interest or resonate with them in different ways. What resonates with them changes and, of course, they’re each different but we usually find something that is agreeable. Three places that I really enjoy seeing ideas are Sonlight, Read Aloud Revival and Homegrown Learners. Of course, not everything I notice is a go but I keep them in the back of my mind and I just really appreciate the information.
So, there we go! Our way of doing things would be too unschoolish for some and too structured for others, but for us, right now, it seems to be a great process.
I’m always interested in finding out about different titles, ideas or ways of doing things. Please feel free to share any you might have or other thoughts about teens and literature:).
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Erin, love this post. We are big fans here of Poetry Teatime, Coffee and Books and now Literature and Vending Machine Snacks 🙂
Lots of buddy reading, read alouds, great conversations and lots of time on Goodreads, all contribute very nicely to our family’s literature studies. Not sure I would’ve even started War and Peace on my own but reading it with my daughter, I loved it and it’s been the same for so many so-called classics.
Totally didn’t get what all the fuss was about when I was at school and my English teacher was a great guy who I looked up to enormously, even named our dog after him 🙂 Hoping he’d like that!
But despite his enthusiasm, it’s only now reading great books because I, or one of my children wants to, rather than because we ‘have to’, that these books have any meaning. Seeing them through their eyes and sharing our thoughts is just such a joy 🙂
Thanks for sharing your experiences and the wide range of discussions you guys have had, very inspiring x
First of all, how hilarious that your dog is named after your English teacher – that’s awesome:).
Thanks so much for your comment. I actually saw your blog post about Goodreads. I had no idea of the history and all that was available! And War and Peace might be a great idea for us…
It took me a long time to get to writing this post because I wondered if it was just “too much.” It’s a lot of information so I wasn’t sure if it would resonate with anyone but me, lol, but it continues to be something that seems to be a really good fit and I guess I was hoping that it might be helpful to give some examples of how deeply literature can be explored just for its own merit – without expectation, comparison of abilities or force (for example, it’s not really my daughter’s thing, at least for the moment).
I think I’m also conscious of the use of the term “unschooling” because it means different things to different people and I try to be really respectful of that. I do think there’s a place for clear labels so that people can understand a philosophy as cleanly as possible. Maybe the reading of all of these books on the same afternoon of the week in similar places and the use of terms that are often found in English classes seem pretty “schoolish” – I’m not sure. I use it here in the context of enjoying literature without expectation. Not only do I not have expectation of what they do with the information, I don’t have an expectation of what conversations will transpire because I don’t read ahead. The ones I have previously read, I haven’t read super recently. On the other hand, though, this isn’t something the guys came to me with and asked to do so it isn’t the “self-directed” aspect of unschooling. It’s very much something I suggested because I sensed my youngest son was looking for more collaboration and good conversation. Each book is a very clear and honest “strew” and so far there have only been a few that haven’t held interest. Ha, so now my response is getting as long as the post. Thanks again!
I think, as you say, the ‘without expectation’ part is key, love that 🙂
‘Inspiring, not requiring’, might be a TJED quote not sure but think it benefits from that qualifier too, that they don’t HAVE to be inspired, maybe they will, maybe they won’t, might come later (planting those seeds) and might come never.
Our challenge is being okay with that and respecting them, their choices and their learning journey. ..’not really my daughter’s thing, at least for the moment’ and that’s cool. Some days it can be quite a challenge though, hey?
And love that too, the recognition and respect that people change 🙂
Hi Hayley, Yes, I think you’re right that it is a TJED quote. Actually, I’m glad you said that because that gets me thinking that there is another TJED piece about structuring time, not content, and I think this kind of makes sense here as well. We agree upon content together and really, it could change entirely, but it’s been working well for all to protect that segment of weekly time. And yes, cool but challenging is a GREAT way to put it. Thanks!
I know you mentioned that they don’t all enjoy fantasy but have you considered The Maze Runner series?
I hadn’t thought of The Maze Runner – thank you. I think my oldest son read those and if I’m remembering correctly, it’s a trilogy. I don’t know a ton about them but I’ll have a look. Thanks for the idea:).
Hi Erin. I really like some of these ideas!
This may be an odd question but I’m actually curious how you decided where to meet and do this. I run into other homeschoolers at libraries so often and I’ve talked to a couple of people who meet regularly at libraries. It sounds like you have a regular day. Do you reserve a study room? Do you ever meet at your house? I’m asking because if we were ever to connect with a few people to do this, I’m not sure I want to host every week🙄.
Hi Lori,
A lot of it is related to sports/activity for the guys. They like to meet up and either play basketball or skateboard so it is often dependent on which skate park or basketball court works best in relation to weather, who they are meeting up with, etc. A few of these community centres have libraries and it works really well. We don’t reserve a study room, but actually I wish that we could. Our closest library offers that option but these other ones that are in community centres don’t offer the option of reserving so we have to kind of keep an eye out or be aware of what times they tend to be available. Usually it works out to have access to one though.
Yes, we have met at our house quite a few times, especially when it’s nice enough weather for them to play basketball on the driveway. I don’t blame you for not wanting to host all the time. It’s actually kind of nice to meet somewhere neutral anyway and often if we’ve finished a book, because it’s a library, we can look for another option right away. Hope this helps:).